http://www.xtremeracingtuning.com/forum ... f=40&t=429
From the driving I have done, its fantastic. Its always had that dead spot below 3500 rpm, you push the throttle and it takes ages for the car to catch up. I always felt like the throttle was a second or so behind what I wanted. I installed a lightweight crank pulley to get a better throttle response and it worked but its nothing comparred to what you have done.
As soon as I even think about touch the throttle the whole car surges, I actually remember getting my head thrown back because I wasn't ready for how immediate it is! It has made the car so so SO much better to drive and that second or so of lag time is gone.
It really took some time to get used to it. Useually I sat there jamming my foot through the floor trying to get the thing to go forward under 3000rpm, it almost felt like the engine was lagging or choking until you built the revs up (even if you gently squeezed the throttle on). Now its completely different, the slightest touch and it just takes off!! It's also made gear changing much better. Shifting up, the sharper throttle makes it so easy shift fast and keep the power on. I can't really explain how but it felt so much easier with every gear shift to get the perfect amount of power to surge into the next gear without working the clutch to death. Heel-and-toe is a heap easier on the downshift.
Through the higher RPM I didn't really notice anything...until I got to a stretch of road I drive along pretty much every single time the testosterone surges lol. I have driven on this road a hundred times in this car, I have every apex down to a fine art, late braking and right at the limit because the road surface is perfect and there's no-one for miles. I went for a run and damn near killed myself!! The extra speed I was getting every time I put my foot down completely threw me off and I started to realise what you had done to it!!
The engine just revs so freely, it doesn't have that sluggish, delayed feel anymore. Even in the high RPM it's just that little bit quicker (although I would LOVE to extend the redline just a little tiny bit further ) As soon as I touch the throttle the RPM snaps up and its away and I was picking up so much more speed!! It's almost like you've found the SPORT button and switched it on. It reminds me more of my friends car, a BMW coupe with a 2.5l turbo engine (automatic). It was a fantastic car simply because you'd touch the throttle and the car would respond instantly, and now the Liberty is a similar story. Even when I get lazy and jump off the throttle, the engine bounces almost as if it's saying "hey!! a little smoother next time!!" lol
I couldn't care less if the graphs show a 1kw increase because the driving experiance is so much better. In my opinion, the quicker a car responds to your commands the closer the connection feels and hence, the driving experiance is better. You have made the car so that it doesnt matter what I'm doing: high speed, low speed, high rpm, low rpm...all I do is flex my big toe and the car responds instanty...and I love it!!!
v0 - I really noticed the change in throttle, it was by far the single biggest improvement to the car. v0 completely changed and sharpened the throttle response and brought so much extra power to the lower rpm region. It made the car react so much faster when going on and off the throttle, expecially in that dead spot under ~3500rpm. This brought the car to life!!!! That delay in the throttle is gone and it feels so eager to get down to business. Gear shifting is much better. Sharper throttle makes it easier to hammer up the gears and much easier to heel-and-toe.
v1 - This was when I noticed some extra mid range power. It felt like it was pulling through 3rd gear much better, especially between ~3500-5500rpm. It was almost the same right down low and right up high but it definitely felt like it was accelerating faster through the mid range.
v2 - With the first two roms really bringing out the power in the low to mid range rpm, I felt this rom affected the high range more then anything. It's really hard for me to describe exactly what I feel as most of my motor vehicle experiance is with bikes.
v3 - Most noticible thing is the new rev limit. I don't useually force the valves of my car dance on the bonet but I must admit, having the engine wind out to 7000rpm is more exciting then excitement itself!! lol. It's there if I need it, and now it means I can hit 100km/hr in 2nd gear instead of needing to shift to 3rd. Knocked over a second of its 0-100 time!!! No real change in the low-mid range but definitely a lot more fun in the higher rpm
v4 - Scary times!! lol Rev limit pushed even further to 7200...I had to beg for my engine's forgivness after the 3rd gear pull to limit. I was driving back home through a windy section of road and it was actually getting a bit tail happy!!!! The road was damp but still the AWD system useually plays it safe and it's stupendously difficult to get the tail out. Now with v4 installed, I really had to watch putting the power down out of some of the corners because I could feel it stepping to the side. Also gear changing when powering out of the long corners meant being more careful because the sharper throttle really puts the power down on every up shift.
All in all I absolutely love your work Edward, its truly amazing how much this tune has changed my car. So so so so SO many people said "don't bother with the NA engine, because the factory tune is pretty well perfect bla bla bla..." I say to those people: you are STUPID IDIOTS!!!! The factory tune is NOTHING!!! It is absolute crap comparred to how my car is now performing. I went back to stock tune the other day and it truly honestly felt as if I had just got out of my MY08 Subaru Liberty and into a 1997 Ford Laser. First thing I did was stall, second thing I did was get bored lol.
For anyone that is a true motoring enthusiast and that has an NA engine, I would reccomend them to you because no-one can argue with the results you get!
Please find attached the 3rd gear pulls and driving logs for v5. I couldn't feel too much difference between v4 and v5 except in the high rpm range. Through the low to mid range I didn't notice anything but up in the higher rpm, expecially when I was just driving how I normally do, I noticed that the revs just felt like they were climbing faster. When I got to around 5000rpm I noticed it just felt quicker to get up to 6500 and it really feels agressive when I jump on the power. The whole car wobbles going on and off the power...time for suspension upgrade lol.
Its just so much more exciting!!! I can't say it enough! I jump on the throttle and it feels like I've just stood on a land mine lol. It immediately responds so it FEELS more powerful.
From: Edward [mailto:email@example.com]
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2012 7:16 AM
Subject: RE: Some reading for you.
First let me say your reviews are great and each customer will have their own ways in doing things.
Its gain in graph.
Viciously Tuned, Driven Hard
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2012 3:12 AM
Subject: RE: Some reading for you.
Thanks so much for v6!! Can't wait to try it out and see how it goes I read the reviews that were posted and I wish I had seen what this guy had written ages ago. I have found he really explains things very well and I agree with him about nearly all topics. I wish I had been able to write better reviews for you to go by.
After all the hard work you have put in, I will try to get you some better logs and better reviews to go by.
I have been watching the graphs but they are meaningless in my opinion. The graphs could show a 10kw gain or a 10kw LOSS and you know what? I DONT CARE!!! lol. Regardless of power and torque, you have completely transformed my car into such an exciting animal!! I really got to know v5 on the drive down and its incredable.
Through the mountains I was getting so much response from so little power! It like the hills don't bother it as much, it seems to be less affected by a sudden incline. Also I have noticed a really good fuel economy as well! I admit I am completely useless when it comes to reviews, but below are some of the comments that I really agreed with and found usefull to explain more how the car feels:
""On the stock ROM if you put your foot down flat to the floor, the tach very slowly starts to raise but the speedo doesn't really budge for another 3-5 seconds. Now I can put in less than 50% throttle and the car will pick up 5kph in about 2.5 seconds in 4th gear from 2000rpm. ""
""In sensible gearing, the car picks up very quickly now. It's easy to hoon around and get to 100kph without even getting close to getting flat to the floor. of course power-runs will still require you to go flat-foot, but the majority of the power is delivered at the top of the pedal now, and I like it. Flat-footing it barely adds anything to the acceleration force you've already got.""
""I can easily take more corners in third without feeling like the car is about to lag and require a drop to second. The new bottom end allows the car to build up from low rpm quicker than before and get back into the meaty sweetspot of rpm nirvana. In a typical long left sweeper, the car just felt magical powering through it in third.""
I really can't say how impressed I am by your workmanship. You have reached the point where you have pleased the customer (hey! I'm super happy!!! lol) and yet you still perservere to get the best possible results you can attain. You loyalty and integrity is above reproach.
I can guarantee you 100% that one day I WILL buy a top-of-the-line Subaru WRX STI and I WILL be paying you to tune it
turner_822 wrote:Hey Edward,
Thought I would write a little post about your magnificent work for people to read!! I drove 3hours down to the coast yesterday and wow! Really found regular driving a huge difference. I had a passanger (admittedly a small one lol), a boot load of luggage, full tank of fuel and the car felt lighter then ever!! The engine immediately responds when I put my foot down and I could feel it pulling uphill and through corners like a dream!! 3000-4000rpm has SO much more then it used to because I'd always have to drop down a gear whenever I approached it.
General day-to-day driving is unrecognisable!! I find myself constantly overshooting corners, missing apex's and trying to jam my brake pedal through the floor because it just really picks up SO much more speed in the low-mid range. I was driving and saw a big, long, smooth, clear straight and couldnt help myself; I wound 4th out to ~170-180km/hr and I can tell you, it wasn't looking to slow down anytime soon!
In my opinion, the entire car was so dull for one reason: the engine was a second or two behind the throttle. Now when I jump on the throttle I get my head thrown back!! Not because of huge forces or anything, but just because im not ready for it!! I keep subconsciously trying to think "ok, I have a second before it takes off" and it useually results in "ok, I have a...OH CRAP!!!!"
Rev limit of 7200 is boarderline terrifying!! The car just keeps howling louder and louder and i'm just waiting for the valves to jump out and perform the riverdance on my bonnet! 2nd hits 100km/hr and 3rd.......well I wasn't really looking at the speedo when redlining 3rd lol I know it isn't the best treatment for your engine but hey, I take care of its servicing and I bought this car to excite me, not to sit shining in the shed!!
Considdering the relativly tiny amount of money you have charged me for your services Edward, it is dollar for dollar THE best thing I could have done to my car and would reccomend you and XRT to everyone that will listen!! I promise you I'll be back one day with a brand-spanking-new WRX STI
turner_822 wrote:HyRax wrote:Your first car! You lucky bugger - I wish I'd known about Subaru when I got my first car back in '97!turner_822 wrote: Hey, I love to write reviews but this being my first car means I struggle to explain myself but I'll do my best!!
It did feel that way, didn't it? The stock tune also made the car feel somewhat heavy and underpowered.turner_822 wrote: In my opinion, the entire car was so dull for one reason: the engine was a second or two behind the throttle.
I've come to realise that the stock tune is crap simply because Subaru don't know where and how you are going to drive your car. The stock tune is safe in the driest and coldest conditions all the way through to the hottest and most humid conditions. You've now discovered what can happen when your car is tuned to your local atmospheric coniditions (as did I). That said, I found Edward's tune to perform admirably in summer, but the best performance is always going to come in cooler, denser temperatures.
Keep modding the 2.5i as you go even before you get the STi (mostly because it's just fun to do, and you learn a lot!) - I'm in the process of installing a full set of STi Brembo's, discs, braided lines and STi master brake cylinder on my 2.5i this weekend because my spirited mountain driving is causing me brake fade! Should allow me to stretch the legs of my own tune a bit further!turner_822 wrote: I am only doing basic mods because WHEN (not if!) I get an STI I will spend stupendous amounts of cash to get everything as good as it gets, then see if I can stay alive long enough to enjoy them!
I agree, I think the stock tune is just generic for all conditions/drivers. That's why I got so annoyed hearing "ohh mate, can't tune that! Factory tune will be perfect". Then Edward walks in and turns the thing into an animal!!
I have learnt so SO much working on my car. Coming from road bikes its a whole new world but I'm learning and loving it
I have found the brakes to fade especially through the mountains and it leads to some butt-clenching moments lol. I am looking to upgrade the suspension and firm it up a bit, then its onto the brakes.
west_minist wrote:V7 have greater low end torque
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 8:08 AM
Subject: RE: v8
I first installed in back before my surgery while I was on holidays and drove home with it. I can't really remember how v6 was but I remember having some amazing fun on the way home with v7 when I was in the high rpm range
I remember noticing some slight changes in the top end. It seemed to hold on to the power as it went over 5000rpm. When the car really starts to surge at around 4000rpm the power seems to drop away a bit at about 5000rpm. v7 felt like it improved this and helped it to hold onto the power. Instead of that fantastic surge of power between 4000-5000 fading away just as I start to enjoy it, it now seems to last longer. The combination effect of all the changes has made me think twice before planting the throttle coming out of the turns!!
I specifically remember a winding set of turns through the mountain where it was perfect to just hold in 2nd gear, working between 3000-6500rpm felt fantastic!! The car felt VERY aggressive and I went on/off the throttle and I could feel the power wanting to kick the car into under/oversteer (AWD working hard to keep me alive lol).
turner_822 wrote:Those graphs are awesome Edward!! They tell such a small part of the story, the car feels FANTASTIC to drive!! The best part is re-loading the stock and feeling the boring and sluggish it is. With stock settings, I put my foot down and its like the engine takes a moment to decide what to do...and I get bored, lol.
It is like two different cars!! The way it picks up speed down in the low RPM, the extra torque and the way it immediately reacts when I touch the throttle. It's hard to describe but put it this way, I took my friend for a drive before and after v7 and had him giggleing like a school girl by the time I'd wound out 3rd!!
I feel spoilt rotten and lack the works to thank you for all the extra time you spent tinkering with this Edward!!
turner_822 wrote:The car felt even faster! It was hauling when I first set off with the intake temp around 18 degrees. Then it stabilized at about 23-25 degrees but it was still going really well. I noticed in particular how it behaved when cruising in 5th gear at 100km/hr. It sits at about 2600rpm and when I put my foot down it instantly starts picking up speed and pulls up hills really well. It has this real surge between 2500-3000rpm that was definitely not there before, in fact it used to feel like crap when you put your foot down in that rpm range but now its great!!
I can't get over the pull it has between 4-5000rpm. Going from 1500rpm, its a bit slow but then really picks up between 2500-3000rpm. Its a bit slow from 3000-4000 but then it takes off between 4000-5000 and that surge makes for my favourite part the car's performance.
Power seems to fade a bit as it gets higher (5000 up to 6500rpm) but it's still way better then it used to be. I absolutely love the howling noise the engine makes as it approaches 6500rpm, it says just when to change gear. I know its probably howling in pain and agony, but I don't push it that hard very often and my service intervals are now every 5000km or ~4 months (although recently I have been doing a lot of hard driving for logs...)
Biggest imporvement by far though is the low-mid range power, and I find it getting the better of me sometimes on roads that I know really well. It has made everyday driving 10x better. With a supercharger I will definitely be looking to upgrade my brakes to avoid those bowel clenching moments
To see the difference between stock and v9 still amazes me...especially considdering a stack of local places that basically told me I was an idiot and you can't improve on a so-called perfect stock tune...read the graphs and weep 98 kW - 108 kW and 172 Nm - 191 Nm.
Nice work Edward, improving on what many called "perfection" lol
west_minist wrote:http://forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.p ... 26#p251849
turner_822 wrote:Well I had some real fun with v9c. Edward has got the car really dialed in. I will have to log some 3rd gear pulls so Edward can post the graphs but he didn't tell me what he changed for v9c.
Straight away I noticed the difference down low. The power feels so smooth now and that slow spot between 3000-4000rpm is pretty much gone. As I accelerated, it would pick up at 2500, drop off a tiny little bit at 3000, pick up again at 4000 and finally drop off at 5000. Now; the power seems to build really smoothly from 2500rpm right up to 5000 before the power fades away. It just feels like it's reving so freely because it's no longer getting held up by that slow spot between 3000-4000rpm.
Didn't really get out of town so I couldn't stretch its legs and feel for any changes in the high rpm range. I look forward to finding out in the morning though
My friend who has driven the car a few times absolutely loved the tune. I didn't tell my older brother (original owner) about the tune and he was very supprised when he first drove it. Also that was only with ?v7 I think. They are yet to see Edward's recent work.
Thank you.From: NickT
Sent: Saturday, July 06, 2013 9:07 PM
Subject: Re: v17b
I can say that v17b is probably the sweetest ROM you have ever sent me!
The car just rockets away in the lower RPM like never before, power between 2500-3500 is just perfect.
Short shifting under partial throttle is just awesome! Better then a WRX. It's like the engine reacts to every little input by the throttle so instantly and smoothly in the same way that larger NA engines do
http://forum.liberty.asn.au/viewtopic.p ... 25#p374024
Everything internal on the stock engine has run amazingly well (run >25,000km). I was amazed with the results and the capabilities of the 2.5i stock engine. The only thing I changed was the cams and I actually regret doing that! It didn't need them.
XRT did brilliant work on my car - 10/10